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The Norfolk Broads Forum / General Chat / Private Boating subsidises Hire Boating.
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Posted By Discussion Topic: Private Boating subsidises Hire Boating.

Similar Threads That Might Help :
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fendoff
Feb-16-2007 @ 4:10 PM                           Permalink
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Some interesting facts emerge from Broadsheet No 17. Private craft contribute 60.4 % to the Navigation income, Hire boats 35.6 % and other craft 4 %.

In the same publication a boat census " confirms hire craft dominate ". On the days when the census was undertaken 68 % of all boat movements were Hirecraft.

I think this proves that the Private Owner is being unfairly treated when our yearly toll rise is more than a Hire Boat. Private Owners should not have to subsidise Hire Boats and hence private companies in this way. This is most unfair. Hire boats should contribute to the pot more in line with the use they make of the waterways.

fendoff

ADAW
Feb-16-2007 @ 4:48 PM                           Permalink
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Maybe the weather was poor on the given day? Locals/private users stayed off the water? That could account for the high proportion of hire boats.They'd payed for their days hire or weeks hire.

I should also imagine the hire companies (indirectly  and directly) contribute greatly to the local economy? Tourism, pubs, restaurants,shops, taxis,employment etc.

I think perhaps your statement "I think this proves that the Private Owner is being unfairly treated when our yearly toll rise is more than a Hire Boat. Private Owners should not have to subsidise Hire Boats and hence private companies in this way. This is most unfair. Hire boats should contribute to the pot more in line with the use they make of the waterways" has been painted with a fairly broad brush.

Naturally I stand to be corrected Wink

ADAW

"There is no replacement for displacement."

roya
Feb-16-2007 @ 4:58 PM                           Permalink
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Fendoff mate,
If my toll helps some folk to have their first Holiday on the Broads and their pennies they spend i am one happy bunny.
I first dicovered the Broads as a tourist,one of my biggest pleasures is talking to holiday makers at Ranworth  Staithe,to see how they are getting on.
I think the hire boat yards contribute enough as it is.  Smile

roya

A Day without a smile is a wasted day

JennyMorgan
Feb-16-2007 @ 6:54 PM                           Permalink
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I was personally involved with the toll hike, both at consultation and subsequently approving the rise. Many factors were considered, not least comparing with other areas and usage patterns.

The issue of share was very carefully considered, believe you me. The consultaion body was predominately private boat owners, and we all agreed that the hire boats had long paid an unfair share.

If any private boat owner feels that they are not getting value then the solution is obvious, use your boat more!

Are 64% of boats on the Broads private boats?

Jenny Morgan,

'that ryvers may be ffre and common to all men for fyshing and passage'
Robert Kett 1549.

This message was edited by JennyMorgan on Feb-16-07 @ 5:56 PM

Craig
Feb-16-2007 @ 7:18 PM                           Permalink
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OK, here is a very rough calculation based on the number of craft seen last year - reported to the database:

Total Number of Boats seen in 2006 - 3552
*Total Number of Private Boats - 2445 (68.8%)
Total Number of Brokerage Boats - 235 (6.7%)
Total Number of Hoseasons Boats - 343 (9.7%)
Total Number of Blakes Boats - 325 (9.1%)
Total Number of Independants - 194 (5.5%)
Total Number of Official Boats - 10 (0.3%)

Total Non-hire - 2690 (75.7%)
Total Hire - 862 (24.3%)

* - the number of private craft is definitely under estimated because I cannot visit all the private moorings, so boats not out on the river during my time on the Broads are likely to be missed - much fewer of the hire craft are missed

Craig

Craig
http://www.horning.org.uk
http://boats.horning.org.uk
http://broadlandarchive.horning.org.uk

Craig
Feb-16-2007 @ 7:19 PM                           Permalink
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Oh, I should have said, the figures do include registered dinghies (if they have a reg number) and unpowered sailing yachts, which I believe have a lower rate of tax

Craig

Craig
http://www.horning.org.uk
http://boats.horning.org.uk
http://broadlandarchive.horning.org.uk

Antares_9
Feb-16-2007 @ 7:44 PM                           Permalink
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My personal view is the Broads tolls are still some of the best value around, hire boats whilst possibly contributing less overall still pay more per sq. foot and most are laid up unused and not navigating most of the year leaving us a nice clear run at what can be a most beautiful time of year. I certainly can not see how I can be subsidising hire boats when we are paying around half the toll of a similar sized hire vessel. The real problem with Broads based boats is a perennial one and really is certainly not peculiar to the broads, most stay in the marina and are rarely used.
Take a look at the number of boats at only (say) Brundall, then imagine them all out at the same time, me, I’m glad they are not used otherwise it would be easier to walk to Loddon from our marina across the logjam of boats. Smile

Cat philosophy:
Life is sweet for a broads ships cat

Rondonay
Feb-16-2007 @ 10:07 PM                           Permalink
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Hi,

I realise that we are paying more as private owners. However, I have the convenience of having a boat on the mooring when I wish to have it. Possibly one day in twelve across the year.  Hire boats are probably out for a third of the year?

Yes I use local traders, but only when I am in Norfolk, if they rely on me and other non-resident owners, they will close.

I think my higher toll supports an infrastructure that I value, so...fine by me.

Pauline

'Stop it you silly ass!' cried the Rat from the bottom of the boat 'You can't do it! You'll have us over!'

BroadAmbition
Feb-16-2007 @ 10:38 PM                           Permalink
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I'm in the same camp as most of you here. Quite happy with the rates that we as private owners are paying and if that is subsidising the holiday makers then so be it. I like to think my tolls are going to the greater good of the Broads. For the same reason I allways buy a fishing License even though I only fish for one week a year at present although soon to change in a BIG way!  -  Griff

One of these decades we WILL finish Broad Ambition !!

osdguy
Feb-17-2007 @ 1:22 AM                           Permalink
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I think in comparison we do pay more than the yards, their boats are out 24/7 for 7 months of the year, even if I was to spend every weekend on the rivers and all my leave time i could not even come close to getting as much use out the broads as a hire craft.
However the local economy does need the hire industry and for that I can see sense in incentivising the yards with discounts, if that be by the tolls then so be it.
But then again privateers rarely benefit from hire craft it is the local traders, so why aren't they subsidizing the hire industry to some degree?

I'd be much more happy if the yards were on a sliding scale for tolls, the less accidents / incidents their craft involved in the less they pay (to a set min) but if their boats regularly speed etc then the toll should also rise as their customers are directly affecting the broads from all sorts of angles.
Just might encourage th yards to make sure they give proper briefing to hirers.

But when all is said and done I'd rather be able to whinge like this and subsidise the industry than to be faced with no holiday makers, run down towns, and the sound of silence when you can't hear kids enjoying themselves.


regards

Marc & Karen
(osdguy)

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