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The Norfolk Broads Forum / General Chat / Fire at Richardsons
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Posted By Discussion Topic: Fire at Richardsons

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plesbit
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:01 PM                           Permalink
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I can't quite decide whether this is all heading rather OT or not so I'll make just this one comment on the subject rather than cause the thread to drift further.

Essentially though I agree completely with Karen (not for the first time) and Simon W.  My wife and I are 30 and we've so far chosen not to have children.  My wife wants them, I don't.  Not because I actually don't want to have kids but because I lived in a cr*ppy area of Dundee for 8 years and the creatures I witnessed there totally changed my perception of children.  Goodness knows, once upon a time I wanted to be a teacher.  Now my wife and I are just staggered at the what kids can get away with now.  They know they can away with more or less anything so they do.  Like Simon W my wife and I feel that even though we're still young we grew up in a different world.

A friend of mine is a teacher in Canada (her home country).  The UK, due to the shortage of teachers over here, has been doing huge recruiting compaigns for years to attract Canadian teachers but she tells me that British schools and schoolchildren have such an awful reputation that it's become something of a joke amongst her colleagues - kind of like the equivalent of German WWII soldiers being sent to the Russian front.

Well we've brought it on ourselves, completely and utterly.  And what's more, now that we can't recruit teachers or police and our yob culture has become legendary across Europe, we continue to refuse to learn from our mistakes when pretty much everyone can see what needs to be done to solve it.

Anyway, that's my bit!  Smile   Please carry on.

Simon

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Speleologist
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:04 PM                           Permalink
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Peter, you are absolutely right. I think it's also fair to suggest that the chances that the perpetrators of this gross act of wanton vandalism were not Romany people. Scumbags, Toerags, call them what we like, but please lets not implicate an already much maligned and persecuted racial group.

Robin
www.robin.me.uk

Jimbo
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:11 PM                           Permalink
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Aaaahhh Bless um! I must remember to have a whip round for um next time they come round our way stealing the slates of the barn roof!!!!! tounge-in-cheek

expilot
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:18 PM                           Permalink
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These "ne'er-do-wells and scumbags" are someone's children.  For those on this forum whose kids have turned out just fine, give yourselves a well earned and well deserved pat on the back - parenting is the most difficult job in the world.  Do you always know where your teenagers are, what they're doing and with what sort of crowd they might be mixing?  If your answer to that is, "Yes" then you'd better wake up and smell the coffee.  Part of being a teenager is being secretive.

Is there no-one on this forum who remembers the mischief they got up to as kids?  No, of course you didn't go around committing arson, but then the hardest drug you may have encountered then was probably Cherry Linctus.  These youngsters have a wretched time not to have chosen to grow up in.

The rot sets in as soon as they perceive themselves to be failures.  The state education system is perfectly designed to alienate kids from any sort of normality.  A child who has learned not to value himself is incapable of learning to value anything else or to adopt someone elses's set of values which will feel alien to him.

These kids are wholly wrong to have done what they did.  Their actions are inexcusable.  What may well have started out as a prank has gone very badly wrong and could so easily have been life-threatening.

These incidents will increase in frequency until their root causes are fathomed and remedied.  Would they not have done what they did if the fear of punishment were greater?  They would.  When you perceive that you have nothing to lose then YOU HAVE NOTHING TO LOSE.  

I speak as an ex-headteacher and one who has been the victim of mindless vandalism.

"There are old pilots.  There are bold pilots............."

This message was edited by expilot on Oct-10-06 @ 9:29 PM

Karen&Mike
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:18 PM                           Permalink
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Virtually everything is considered offensive to somebody or other these days - thats my opinion, and I think we make too big an issue of it. We need to stop pussyfooting around and get over this obsession with words and phrases. Its what we DO that matters, I believe.

Lifes too short.

I'm not wishing to upset anyone or any group of people, I'm just expressing my view about the use of words and the way its all labelled as racist or not politically correct - in itself this can be very provocative and likely to cause trouble that wasnt there...I know that many people see this differently and feel that using such words is racist - I'm simply throwing my views and feelings into this as a different view point...

Karen & Mike (who says "ditto")





"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"

This message was edited by Karen&Mike on Oct-10-06 @ 9:20 PM

Speleologist
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:18 PM                           Permalink
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Jimbo,

Thereby hangs the problem. So some people, (Who you assume to be Romany) have stolen some slates. So let's tar all of them with the same brush. OK, lets suppose that eh kids responsible for the episode at Richardsons were English, does that mean that ALL english are arsonists?

I happen to have several friends of the Romany race who are honest, law abiding citizens, so yes, it is offensive to tar all with the same brush. By that token all moslems are sucide bombers, all Irish are thick, or whatever other racial stereotypes we choose to perpetrate.

Robin
www.robin.me.uk

andyfish
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:19 PM                           Permalink
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how do
I dont think mike used the word pikey to insult gypsies or anybody else for that matter.
however pussyfooting around or arguing about suitable names for these lowlife is taking us away from the issue

who forgot the mud weight

JennyMorgan
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:36 PM                           Permalink
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I suspect that Mike was not aware of the offence that such a term could cause. How could he be aware whether there are Romany folk amongst us or not?

I don't for one minute think that he had intended offence.

Personally I am proud of my great grandmother, a Romani Chi. Whether they are aware of it or not, many Norfolk & Suffolk folk have Romany blood, albeit from a long time ago.

The term 'pikey' is to the Romany as is 'nigger' to a black man. Nothing to argue over but worth putting the record straight.

Personally I haven't taken offence, but I am well aware that if we do have Romany amongst our group, and there is no reason why not, then there are some  who would be deeply offended.

Jenny Morgan,
Being the name of my boat and the generic name applied to the flag atop of a Norfolk Wherry mast, unique to Broadland. Now you know!

This message was edited by JennyMorgan on Oct-10-06 @ 9:41 PM

simonw
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:41 PM                           Permalink
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"The rot sets in as soon as they perceive themselves to be failures.  The state education system is perfectly designed to alienate kids from any sort of normality.  A child who has learned not to value himself is incapable of learning to value anything else or to adopt someone elses's set of values which will feel alien to him" To Qoute Expilot

Sir i have read most of your post's on here and find your views/info etc most enlightening,however you have highlighted my main point,Respect begins at home,Self esteem begins at home it has nothing to do with the education system (thats an excuse for the parents who couldnt care less)Everyone of an adult age knows what is right and wrong if not quite so within the eyes of the law it is about time we stopped making excuses for peoples behaviour and started to make them RESPONSIBLE for their actions, i am sorry if this upsets people but "wake up and smell the coffee" i have never behaved like this and my children wont(if they do i will drive them to the police station myself,and insist they are charged),But this i do out of love and guidance for my girls'  future ...enough said because heart monitor says i am officially dead lol.....si

This message was edited by simonw on Oct-10-06 @ 9:45 PM

pks1702
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:42 PM                           Permalink
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JM people of a certain age do see the word Pikey as a slang term for 'Diddycoys'in my youth it did not mean true Romanys.

Ask any teenager these days what a Pikey means and they will explain this as a Chav,Mong, Waster or other modern day slang term for an individual of dubious character, very few associate this with Romanys. The trouble is 'travellers' have given true Romanys a bad name.

In the modern PC world minority groups take precedence over the majority and instead of engaging in reasoned debate shout 'foul'.This in my view is storing up a major backlash as other cultures seek to impose their minority cultures on the majority. An example 'Christmas Lights' being deemed offensive to other religious groups!

Back to yobs of whatever persuasion as has already been said it comes down to lack of discipline and lack of deterrent.

Sorry did not mean to get all political but the current PC culture is at the route of most of what is wrong with our current culture and standards

Regards

Perry

This message was edited by pks1702 on Oct-10-06 @ 9:43 PM

J&B
Oct-10-2006 @ 10:45 PM                           Permalink
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We have just returned from a week on the broads on Star Gem 3,and were amazed to hear about the fire on the radio,..we headed back to the yard on Monday 9th, to spend our last night,and after seeing the damage to the boats, we were a wee bit apprehensive of staying there overnight,I also checked my car, and found it to be all in one piece thank goodness,...As to the issue of security,.the police landrover, patroled the quays every 1/2hr,which was a comfort to the missus.....Maybe now they will tighten up on security,....A nice wee job for Peter, since his retirement..lolol..As he stays on his boat in the yard.

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