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Posted By Discussion Topic: stalham moorings

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Paladine
May-15-2018 @ 8:01 PM                           Permalink
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Meanwhile, at Ludham Bridge, these are the two boats on the bank adjacent to the EA moorings.

I can't help wondering if it will cost the farmer more to get rid of them than it would have cost him to renew the piling and renew the lease with the BA  tounge-in-cheek

"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)


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Manko
May-16-2018 @ 1:29 PM                           Permalink
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Just to clarify, my boat in your picture was moored there with full knowledge of the landowners. It is not a wreck and has no connection with Pelican. I was as horrified as anyone when I came here the other day to find that barely afloat wreck next door.

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Paladine
May-16-2018 @ 1:37 PM                           Permalink
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Thank you for that information, Manko. It always helps to know the facts, rather than assumptions. Having that other boat moored next to you isn't going to help your sales effort, is it.

"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)

Manko
May-16-2018 @ 8:50 PM                           Permalink
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I've now moved it Paladine. It would be a disaster to leave my boat there. As a former shopowner at Ludham Bridge who loves the place, I hope the wreck is gone soon. It ruins a beautiful spot.

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Paladine
Jul-07-2018 @ 3:29 PM                           Permalink
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Going back to the original topic, Stalham Staithe, something appears to be happening. A sign has now appeared (see pic). This was erected by Stalham Town Council, not the Broads Authority, so the question of enforcement arises. As far as I know, there are no pertinent bye laws by which the restriction can be enforced, but I would be happy to be proved wrong.

I understand that a senior member of the BA attended the last Town Council meeting, at which the staithe was discussed. Unfortunately, the on-line Town Council minutes are abysmally brief and tell us virtually nothing.

The only possibility for enforcement I can think of is that, by mooring in excess of the 24hr period stated on the sign, other boats wishing to use the mooring are being obstructed from doing so.

Navigation Bye Law 66 says: ” No person shall prevent, obstruct or hinder the lawful mooring of any vessel.“ This applies anywhere on the navigation, not just to BA moorings.

The difficulty I see in trying to use this bye law for enforcement is that the 24hr restriction has no basis in law, unlike the 24hr restriction on BA moorings. In the same way as a boat lawfully moored at a BA mooring cannot be said to be preventing etc., other boats from mooring, the same reasoning could be applied to Stalham Staithe. The overstayers aren’t actually breaking any laws.

All this sign will do is to ensure that the people who wish to use the staithe in a reasonable fashion, and not just to avoid paying a mooring fee, will move on after 24 hours. The freeloaders will still freeload.


"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)


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Paladine
Jul-07-2018 @ 3:36 PM                           Permalink
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This pic was taken at 9.50am 6 July 2018...

"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)


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Paladine
Jul-07-2018 @ 3:37 PM                           Permalink
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This one was taken 24 hours later.

Can anyone see any similarities between the two?

"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)


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Paladine
Jul-07-2018 @ 9:36 PM                           Permalink
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So who owns Stalham Staithe (the public bit)?

In the yet-to-be-officially-published report on Broads staithes, Tom Williamson says:

“The 1910 Finance Act map and documents (NRO P/DLV/1/103) show a similar situation: the main northern staithe (parcel 328), and the southern part of the southern staithe, were considered the property of the Trustees of the Poor, the northern part of the southern staithe was private property. The northern staithe is still known as ‘Stalham Staithe’: the southern is now mainly occupied by the Museum of the Broads.

Current ownership of the northern staithe is unclear, but seems to have devolved from the Poor’s Trustees to the parish council, now the Town Council: in 2013 the latter body reported that the ‘Clerk confirmed that the land registry search had showed no owner of the Staithe at Stalham registered with the Land Registry’.

In January it resolved ‘To record that Stalham Town Council can find no evidence to support the assertion that any of the land abutting the dyke at the Stalham Staithe has ever been the responsibility of or maintained by the Town Council’.”


I have no idea what research was carried out in order to reach these conclusions, but I am very disappointed that no firm conclusion has been reached. I would have expected that the award giving any, or all, of the staithe for the benefit of the poor of the parish would have been very explicit (as were the Catfield awards).

Nor do I understand the comment ”...seems to have devolved from the Poor’s Trustees to the parish council…”

If the ownership of the staithe was transferred from the Poor’s Trust to the parish council, there will be a record of the transaction in the records of the Trust, and in the minutes of the parish council. Have these records been checked?

Going back to the time just before the 1910 Finance Act mentioned in the report, I have found some interesting references in contemporary newspapers, which gave reports of local affairs (courtesy of British Newspaper Archive).

Extract from The Norwich Mercury, July 16 1892.

Rural District Council … STALHAM STAITHE

A letter was received from Mr Silcock of Stalham calling attention to the state of the Staithe at Stalham. He stated that the highway which ran down to the river was gradually slipping into the water.

Mr PRESS said he examined the spot, and found that for a distance of about 12 yards the shore had slippedinto the river on the north side. Whether it was the Commissioners’ duty “to pull the highway out of the river” he could not say. It was a watering place.

Sir Harry Bullard thought the case was on all fours with Horning Staithe. If so the parish must do the repairs.

The CHAIRMAN said they could not make a quay head where stock went down to the water.

Mr PRESS remarked that he did not know whether cattle ought to be watered there. It was a cut straight up from the river.

Mr Diver observed that there used to be piles there, because he had seen them. The Clerk was directed to write to Mr Silcock that he must look to the parish to do the repairs.


Extract from The Norfolk Chronicle and Norwich Gazette, August 29 1908.

SMALLBURGH: On the sitting of the Rural District Council...The Surveyor reported that Stalham Staithe was in a very bad state with regard to the quay heading. A public road ran round by the Staithe, and the District Council were responsible for the quay heading. They did some repairs three or four years ago, at a cost of £10 or £12.

During the heavy storm of last Saturday part of the roadway next the quay heading gave way. An examination revealed the fact that one or two of the piles had completely rotted away, and the planking between the piles had also gone.

It would be a rather expensive job to put the place right again. The Surveyor, who said about 50 yards wanted repairing, and that the cost would be about 15s. a yard, was directed to prepare an estimate.


Extract from The Norfolk News, October 24 1908.

SMALLBURGH, Rural District Council

STALHAM STAITHE “The Council accepted the tender of Mr Plummer for £39 19s. 6d. for the repairs to the quay heading at Stalham Staithe.

Mr. F.C.Neave – There are a good many we shall have to do if we do this.

The Chairman replied that the quay-heading had always been repaired by the surveyors.

The Surveyor remarked that it was the spot where wherries moored, and it was alongside the roadway”.


So there appears to be some evidence (which could be corroborated by the inspection of the relevant minutes of meetings which were the sources of the newspaper reports) that the maintenance of the staithe was historically carried out by the Rural District Council, which met in council offices in Stalham until 1974, at which time it was absorbed by North Norfolk District Council under the sweeping local government reorganisation of that era.

Which suggests that NNDC now owns the staithe.

Hmmmm...



"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)


This message was edited by Paladine on Jul-7-18 @ 9:40 PM

Still-Cruising
Jul-08-2018 @ 2:17 PM                           Permalink
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Fascinating bit of research Mr P.

Best Regards

Bob

PO20 But NR12 as much as possible.

Paladine
Jul-08-2018 @ 6:48 PM                           Permalink
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"All this sign will do is to ensure that the people who wish to use the staithe in a reasonable fashion, and not just to avoid paying a mooring fee, will move on after 24 hours. The freeloaders will still freeload. "

This pic taken about 3pm today. Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose

"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)


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