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Discussion Topic: Should Hunters yachts cross Breydon?
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Glen_Mist |
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Hi all
Firstly this is purely a theoretical question, based on an incident that happened to me last week, not a call for them to be banned.
On Tuesday last week i was doing the 2 - 10 'late shift'. At about 2.45 i saw 2 of the aforementioned fleet approaching my bridge from up river. Unfortunately i couldn't swing the bridge, due to the fact that a train was imminent, so i watched them to see what they would do.
They both turned into the tide (which was ebbing very strongly) and lowered thier sails and started to quant, not to much success owing to the tide and the depth of the river here. The first one saw the bridge approaching and managed to lower his mast and passed underneath the bridge with do problems at all, albeit still going 'backwards'.
The second one, however, didn't lower, whether unwilling to or not i don't know, and got slowly washed, still quanting like mad, into the bridge hitting it with it's mast and rigging, as stated earlier i could not open the bridge due to the fact that i had already 'cleared' for a train.
Luckily it appeared that no damage was caused and he got pulled onto the Ship quay whereby he lowered his mast and went underneath.
I have recently found out that, despite being experienced crews, that made a bad call and instead of stopping at Berney they crossed Breaydon and got caught by the flood, finally arrving at Yarmouth at gone 8pm.
The reason i ask that if they should be allowed cross Breaydon is that if they were equipped with engines none of this would have happened, now i understand about their 'Old Worlde' charm, and on the Northern rivers above, say Acle, they are a wonderful thing (i am not a sailie but i am led to understand that they sail very well), but on the more tidal, and GP infested, Southern Rivers could they be a liability?
Tin Hat donned and tea and biccies taken from behind the sofa.
Chris J
"Darling, where is that water coming from?"
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billmaxted |
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I would hate to see them banned we don’t see them very often but when I do they are in the hands of crews which give every appearance of knowing what they are doing.
Given that there are plenty of Classic cruisers without engines around on the southern rivers I don’t see that there is really any justification.
You say that these were “experienced crews” but their actions do rather give the impression that they had left their “wise heads” somewhere else. I can understand that they would want to arrive at Gt. Yarmouth after slack water so that they could use the sling shot effect to carry them round into the Bure rather than get carried down into Yarmouth docks. If however experienced, I would have expected them to know that Breydon turns before the Bure and the effect that that would have on their passage time. One might also have expected that they would be already prepared to ‘shoot’ any bridges they came across. Likewise the need to have mudweights ready to use as drag anchors if necessary.
That all said everyone gets it wrong at some time, a matter best left to the wisdom of the Hunters team I would suggest rather than some official who perhaps has never sailed a ‘pure’ yacht.
P.S. I can quite see the appeal of the broader reaches of the Southern Broads to test the performance of these fine old ladies
Bill...(The Ancient Mardler)
This message was edited by billmaxted on Oct-13-07 @ 11:50 AM
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lassies |
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A difficult one.i remember the first time I came on the Broads.We hired Truemans "Calypso" centre cockpit.We thought that we were experienced enough.Sailing every night of the week on inland waters.We set off across Breydon tacking in a force 5,then we came to the bridge.If we had not got a engine we would have gone straight passed the turn for Yarmouth.[You cannot teach people about the strength of the currents,it comes with experience].It was only a 4hp Penta but it got us out of trouble.We then went on Calypso's 2,3 & 4.I wonder if any of those yachts are still about.John
cruiser
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dannyboy |
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Mardles sometimes
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A complete ban would be quite unreasonable. Crossing Breydon in a yacht that requires quanting is something that should be done only under the correct conditions, at the right time and with a sufficiently able crew aboard. One or more of those caveats would seem to be in question on the occasion you describe.
Robin (Speleologist) will no doubt have something to say about this, as he (unlike many of us) has done this several times! I do hope it wasn't him on this occasion!! His web-page gives thorough and detailed advice, as do several others, of the correct procedure in both directions.
Danny
'non semper erit aestas'
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dannyboy |
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It might be that Hunters', from the point of view of the safety of their fleet would wish to ascertain the ability and experience of crews wanting to venture South. Perhaps crews might require the permission of the yard to do so?
Danny
'non semper erit aestas'
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PizzaLover |
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More from another sailor's perspective.
With little wind, and a strong tide behind you, the bridges get very big, very low and very quick. The skipper really doesn't have a lot of time to make the decision to drop the mast. It's good to know that the bridge operators are aware off this.. it would be awful to have the bridge close on you after you'd committed, some distance off, to sailing through it.
It would be nice if there was a better way for yachts to communicate with the bridges. In the scenario described, could the yacht skippers have called the bridge an hour before making passage and taken advice on the best time to go through?
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Glen_Mist |
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Hi PL
Both the numbers for Somerleyton and my bridges have been published in various guides and leaflets, so there is the possibility of phoning ahead to notify the bridge keeper of your rough eta. But having said that, being a sailie yourself you know that 1 hour away can easily change to 2 hours, 3 hours, or 30 minutes. 
Chris J
"Darling, where is that water coming from?"
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PizzaLover |
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Indeed... easily.
Grin.
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Poppy |
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The most experienced helms get it wrong some times - even private owners. To ban those without engines from the lower reaches of either the Bure or the Yare would be wrong, IMHO. A case could be made for banning hire motor boats from these waters, since they regularly appear to go aground. That would be wrong as well!
Poppy
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dannyboy |
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Hi Poppy,
quite right... I once had quite a struggle returning South to North, in a yacht with an auxiliary engine... We had read the tide tables etc. motored under the bridge with mast down and then met more of an ebb than we expected coming down the Bure towards us... it was touch and go and we made very slow progress for a while, in a place where it is very difficult to stop!
Even after careful planning we were still a bit early. Having said that, we have done it on many occasions without trouble. Preparation and precautions are important. Having not taken a Hunters' yacht through I can't comment on the specifics of this thread. IMHO there is a case for more and thorough advice to be made available to ALL who make the crossing, especially those of us who hire.
Danny
'non semper erit aestas'
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Oct-13-2007 @ 11:10 AM
