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Posted By Discussion Topic: ryder marine womack water

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steve
Jan-03-2005 @ 11:19 PM                           Permalink
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said they antifoul our boat £250 back in november so we took it there 4 days later still was,nt done and when we went to collect it , it still was,nt done.the excuse they us was they sub that work out and could,nt get it booked in another yard which was,nt mentioned back in the summer when we enqired nor when we booked it in november.

s.d fisher

roya
Jan-05-2005 @ 6:17 AM                           Permalink
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Hi Steve not very good .has any one else got any coments or used this yard, good or bad.cheers for now.
ps nice to have you on site.

roya

steve
Jan-05-2005 @ 6:40 PM                           Permalink
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hi roya
thanks for the reply. what i have said was only breif detail.the other part was they said that they would take you back to your boatyard to collect your car and when it came to it they said there transport was out at the moment and did not know when it would be back.so we ended up getting a taxi back to stalham.secondly they said to leave our boat at the moorings at womack stathie and 3 days later we get phone call from ludham parish council asking us why the boat has been left there!once explained they was ok.so we gave a large mooring fee when we collected boat.

s.d fisher

jofedup
Jul-11-2005 @ 7:18 PM                           Permalink
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Thank you to "The Norfolk Broads" website for this forum. It's nice to have a place to trawl and find out what other people have to say and many topics that interest us boaters out there. OK, down to the wire:

This is quite a long story and if you’re interested, it illustrates just how easy it is to get ripped off when you know very little about the business you’re in!

The title is: “Would you ever buy a boat?”

My wife and I bought a 1992 Bayliner 2655 5Ltr V8 Mercruiser with Alpha One stern drive from Plymouth last year and had her transported up here to St.Olaves. I had made some enquires prior to purchase and found a small family-run boat hire business that had a spare mooring in a dyke around the corner from St.Olaves bridge. When she arrived she was moved into the boat shed on hard standing to see what would need to be done to her as this boat was bought blind from the Internet. I paid my £150 quarterly mooring fee to the yard and started to ask their advice as to what I could have repaired and fixed-up and what it would cost.

This was the first big mistake. It seems that ignorance on a particular matter can be a major physical impediment and an open ticket for a good rip-off merchant to take full advantage!

We originally had a modest budget and some of that was still left after paying for the boat and the transportation. We knew there were some things that needed to be sorted out and were willing to pay someone to do the job. After all, that is why we had over-budgeted in the first place. I wanted to get the engine serviced and the stern drive checked and serviced if need be before we took her out and did any damage.

The two guys who ran the boat yard seem to think they had hit the jack pot when we showed up with our boat. What started out as a modest shopping list; turned into nightmare. We went from around £1,000 to the last quote of around £7,500 upwards to the point I was thinking I should have bought a completely different boat!

At this point our boat had been hard standing in their boat shed for over two weeks and nothing (nada) had been done to it at all. I turned up one Saturday to find a Diesel Marine Engineer had been running the engine dry and there was water sprayed all around at the back of the boat from its exhaust. Other items had also been ‘pulled-off’ during their inspections including the exhaust hose gaiter from the stern drive. I was told that this would be expensive to put back on as they would need to remove the stern drive completely! Wow!!! The final straw came when we went back to the yard one evening, yet again to decide what was needed to get her in the water and the figure of £7,500 was mentioned. I lost it at this point and my wife was nearly in tears, especially after seeing all their incompetence regarding these types of craft. That night we had a row and I decided to get the boat out of there quickly…

The following day I was hunting around the Internet and Telephone books in the hope of finding a competent, if not qualified, Mercruiser engineer who might also know something about Bayliner boats. As luck did not have it; I ended up speaking to a ‘charming gentleman’ called Jim Ryder. I already had a list of items I needed doing and wanted to know how much each item would cost to fix – in other words a verbal quote would give me enough to calculate whether we could afford to do this (especially after the last ‘Dream-Up-A-Price’ boat yard we landed in). The prices I was hearing sounded like they were out of this world. I wrote them down and ended up with all the things we wanted to be done for around £1,500. This was surely the answer to all our problems, our saviour! I was so impressed at what I heard I asked Jim if he was able to collect my boat from St.Olaves for me as I didn’t want to start it; with it first being serviced and checked for problems like no oil etc.

A week or so went by and finally Jim got around to colleting our boat and towed it to Ryder Marine’s yard. We finally felt like we were getting somewhere at last. The boat was moored in and around their yard including the Parish Council’s property. Jim told us he had ordered all the parts he was going to need to do the work I wanted and as soon as they came he would get to work. This took around three weeks, but gave us the time to start cleaning her and working on the cosmetic stuff we wanted to do anyway. When the parts arrived we then had to wait another week for him to arrange a slot in the yard around the corner to hard stand the boat while the work was done. Well, seems alright so far? Then came the delays…. Still not done, still not done… ummm…. So when will it be done, Jim? I’ll call you….

Finally, we get the call that ALL the work has been done. I am so relieved to hear this I can’t stop jumping up and down.

We had made arrangements for our friends to be there on her maiden voyage and they were travelling up from London for the weekend. We turned up Saturday and made ready. I asked Jim to show me how to start it and drive it as I was that much of a novice. To this he obliged and we were off. One thing I noticed that concerned me was the difficulty he had starting the engine, considering all the work that had been done? Once she started he revved the living daylights out of her with loads of think grey smoke coming out of the back! (Points to notice here: Mercruiser’s recommended cold starting of a carburetted petrol engine was to prime it first i.e. two pushes forward and on the second to bring the throttle back to about 2/3 full. On starting, idle a cold engine a about 1,500 rpm until operating temperature is reached)

Before we left I went to thank Jim for the work he had done for me and to say how pleased I was. He mentioned that the ‘Oil in the leg’ (stern drive) was a good colour. I know this meant that the seals were still good as the oil hadn’t emulsified yet. So had he changed the old oil or left it? The next thing he pointed out was a big new shiny battery he’d put on for me as the other one was apparently knackered. OK, I can see it’s new? He then said I really should get him to look at the engine oil when we got back as it might need changing – I thought you’d serviced the engine, Jim? I was starting to get worried again as I didn’t really know what he’d done while the boat was in their care. He promised me he would service the barrels in the carburettor as there was something in there that would be worn and need replacing (Sounds like this guy knows what he’s talking about, doesn’t it?) I really don’t believe he did anything other than put on a new battery and bolt on the sacrificial anodes I asked him to replace. His daughter sorted out the bill and on numerous occasions told me I wouldn’t pay any VAT if I paid in cash.

What I did get the bill from his daughter it was for £1,135 Incl. VAT. So what did I get for that then?

1)     I actually got the boat anti-fouled in a choice of my own colour.
2)     2 x adult life jackets.
3)     Tow from St.Olaves to Womack Water where Ryder Marine is based.
4)     The rubber stern drive exhaust pipe was ‘pushed’ back on, but I was told not to raise the leg too high in case it fell off!
5)     Less than a month’s mooring.
6)     £350 of the bill to the boat yard he used to hard stand my boat while the work was done!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
7)     A new battery
8)     Sacrificial anode pack
9)     Some small sundry items

I kept reading through the bill that only had a few invoice lines on it .Where was the all the other work I was going to get done for around £1,500 when I’d just given him £1,135 incl. VAT? I later found out that I was charged £350 for the use of someone else’s boat yard while my boat was hard standing waiting to be repaired. This charge was at no time mentioned during the quote. To make things worse, one of their workers later explained that the reason it came to so much was that they ordered the wrong parts for the stern drive and had to wait while the correct ones were delivered. Wait just one minute here; I was paying for my boat to stand there because they had ordered the wrong parts? “Yes”, he said “we ordered parts for an Alpha One Gen 1 and yours is an Alpha One Gen 2!” – Thanks for the information, buddy…. Funny how Jim or Dee never mentioned this little oversite?

A couple of weeks went by and our boat was moved into their dyke at the back of their yard (they had it dredged to free up more mooring places to make a few quid more, I guess) Anyway, Jim had originally told me I could more the boat there for about £65 a month (based on the cost per ft). I was subsequently called by his daughter and told that my monthly mooring would now cost £85!

I wasn’t at all happy about this and told her, saying that they had quoted me one price and now wanted a lot more. She said she didn’t know what Jim had agreed and would leave it as it was. The next day she called me again and told me that I would indeed be paying more and she wanted the whole years mooring up front – in cash. Although, again she mentioned that if it were cash I would not pay the VAT!

I don’t care about VAT, but what I do care about is being quoted one price and then being ripped-off for another!

I told her to leave it with me as this was early in the week and I would come down on Saturday and sort it out. I had already paid my mooring fees to the end of that month that was a week and a half away at that time. Instead of going down to Ryder that weekend we went somewhere else as all the hassles with these moorings and a that bill were getting us down. The week before my moorings expired I called around and found moorings in a lovely marina in Brundall, Norwich. They also turned out to be cheaper at £57 per month with proper shore power that is metered with pump-out and water facilities.

Final Chapter for Ryder Marine:
I turned up at Womack Water on Saturday to begin the trip from the north broad to the south broad and on to Brudall. I thought I would be nice to take my parents out for a short trip before we started out, so they came along too.

When we arrived, the first thing I noticed was my boat was missing from its usual mooring. I located Dee, Jim’s daughter and asked her where my boat was. She smiled and pointed over to the middle of the broad (Womack Water). “Why is my boat in the middle of the broad?” I asked. She told me she knew I would be coming to pick her up and they put her there this morning. I asked where she was moored last night. She told me right where you are standing, here at the public staithe owned by the Parish Council. I found this very strange and wanted to get going to leave this crazy place.

I asked her how I was supposed to get to my boat. She pointed to one of their peddaloe things – or whatever they’re called. I climbed into this thing and peddled across the broad to my boat. When I boarded her, I found glass everywhere!!! The windscreen had been smashed and a stone lay on the deck. This was really starting to turn into a bloody nightmare. I started the engine, pulled up the mud weight and headed for their office. I then confronted Dee and told her that while they had abandoned my boat in the middle of the broad, somebody had thrown a stone through the windscreen and now I have a glass everywhere. Two questions here:
1) Why is my boat taken out of its secured and fully paid-up moorings with CCTV etc. and left out in the middle of the broad?
2) When was it moved there as I have paid for moorings including today, Saturday?

I was then told a string of lies that my annoyed my father such that he called the local police. They didn’t do anything except report another crime statistic for the broads, but what they did do is prompt Dee, Jim’s daughter to apologise to me for lying about where the boat had been left that night (it was probably left there all week as another boat was already in my moorings and they weren’t there for free!)

How did it all end? Well, they offered to send someone around to our new moorings to fix the windscreen and they didn’t renege on that. I cut my finger a number of times on broken glass while they helped me clear it up and we finally set sail with a piece of polythene taped over the hole.

The final nails in the coffin came later though: On mooring up at our new marina, I entered the engine compartment to turn of the battery and guess what? – Jim had changed my nice shiny new battery for an old corroded one with stains all over it!

I’ve since had the engine properly serviced by Marine Power in Brundall and it’s great. It starts first time and purrs so quietly you can hardly hear it. It so transpires that the water pump had gone and the noise from the bearings was deafening. The thermostat had been removed (we don’t know why or by whom), so the engine was never reaching operating temperature which was coating the bores – Nice. The coil was intermittent and needed changing. New plugs, oil and she’s happy as a pig in you know what!

My question is this: how come none of these problems were noticed by a certified Mercruiser Engineer (according to Jim’s daughter, Dee)?

My recommendation is either: to not buy a boat or, if you do, NEVER take it to Ryder Marine to get it fixed!


steve
Jul-11-2005 @ 8:15 PM                           Permalink
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hijofedup,
firstly welcome to the site ,loads of info to find and loads of help when you want it.
secondly i had trouble to with these people at ryder marine as you've read above ,i also agree the daughter is a bad lier , and shall not use these again nor buy any chanderly ,they have no thought for the parish council nor the locals + shops in the village ,
thirdly ,i also had trouble at st olaves at johnsons yacht station with work to our boat ,was promised it would be ready and all done by easter ,only to find out he did'nt start the work till after easter and had to keep chasing him up ,finally got the boat ready 2 months later !
but the best advise i'll give is to do any work your self or get friends or relatives to help you, ,
all the best

steve and vicky

Bounty
Jul-11-2005 @ 10:55 PM                           Permalink
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Boat engineers seem to be like car machanics. If you find a good one stick with him (or her). I ten years of boating on the Broads, I've yet to come across one I can say I really trust. There must be members of this forum who can give some recommendations.

As for getting work done on time; it must be a Norfolk thing, but the pace is slower and deadlines seem to mean little. For the most part, that is why we love it. It has caused us some heartache in the past though.

Finally, I agree with Steve. Most work on a boat can be done by a competent DIY'er, especially servicing. Get to know a friendly boatyard, ask their advice and get them to order parts and do the work yourself. It's more satisfying and you will know how well it has been done.

kfurbank
Jul-11-2005 @ 11:06 PM                           Permalink
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Jofedup, I am really sorry to hear your story.

Where ever possible I am trying to do my own work on the boat, however I would definetely recommend Boulter Marine as being reliable and value for money.

With regard to timescales in general, these seem at best to be an optimistic estimate, where ever you go on the Broads. Even just trying to get estimates can need some patience. Once you get used to this, then you just go with the flow.

Keith

roya
Jul-11-2005 @ 12:23 AM                           Permalink
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Boat Yards
please take note we now have 390 members
a lot of us own boats all we want is the job we pay for done. im sure thats not to much to ask for or is it.
if any members are not happy with the service they have recieved please post here and we can name and shame.
but if it has been good we can praise.

roya

now about my bilges.

osdguy
Jul-11-2005 @ 12:35 AM                           Permalink
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Not that we have been anywhere else,but I must confess that Woodsyke haven't let us down big time yet. Pricing to us is reasonable and work completed in a good time and on the day they say.
We did have a slight prob at the last o/b service, the carb was leaking a bit of fuel after the service, dropped them an email when we got home and it was fixed the next day...can't say fairer than that.


regards

osdguy

Dr-Diesel
Jul-12-2005 @ 8:48 AM                           Permalink
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I'm with Keith regarding Boulters, I do most of my the work on my boat but for the stuff that needs lifting out I have used Boulters and found they kept to timescales, never promised the earth, and were extremely good cost wise.

I think their are enough people on this site to give you any advice you may need.

Paul H

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