Topic: wood interiors.


Greybeard    -- Nov-14-2021 @ 6:35 PM
  I have access to some hardwood, oak etc, and also cedar.

some is tongue and groove, and I was thinking I may line the roof with it.
Anyone previously had success with similar procedures, and what might be a good insulator,[if needed] closed cell foam, or polystyrene type insulation, or  [celotex].
I'v heard it said leaving the wood unvarnished lets it breath, and varnishing will attract condensation.
any thoughts.
cheers.


RayT    -- Nov-14-2021 @ 7:08 PM
  If you hang on you may get some Worms of Wisdy.



JollyRodger    -- Nov-14-2021 @ 9:11 PM
  There are several 100-year-old boats on the Broads, probably all having wood 'ceilings'. So cosy, especially with oil lamps. Yes, varnish what is exposed to the eye, bare for the rest. Crushed cork is the traditional insulator    Wink !

Jolly Roger


Greybeard    -- Nov-14-2021 @ 11:55 PM
  @JollyRodger, my thoughts entirely ,crushed cork, I can get in  various thicknesses, would it be preferable to leave an air gap in there somewhere? between the hull and cork? or between cork and wood.

I'v seen a cork paint advertised too, but the claims seem a little "snake oil" like,, I cant imagine such a thin membrane of paint being as effective as much thicker cork.
I have pretty good ventilation in the boat and I believe this helps no end.

my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


JollyRodger    -- Nov-15-2021 @ 9:32 AM
  If it were me then the cork, either glued or sprayed, would go hard against the roof and I would have an air gap between cork and timber.

Jolly Roger


annville    -- Nov-15-2021 @ 11:37 AM
  Hi I have Oak ply on all my surfaces coated with egg shell varnish keeps it clean looking now ten years old i do have sprayed foam insulation on all surfaces this is much more efficient insulator then cork or glass fibre and has the advantage of insulating every nook and cranny that would be impossible to get sheeted insulation to stick to unless the insulation covers the outer surface you will get condensation between insulation and body this will run down and collect on floor, bilges or where its passage is interupted leading to rot or stains. John


JollyRodger    -- Nov-15-2021 @ 2:39 PM
  That is sound thinking. I have no experience with sprayed foam, is this DIY doable and is it easy to control. e.g.thickness?

Jolly Roger


Greybeard    -- Nov-15-2021 @ 2:48 PM
  the diy aspect was something I too investigated, spray foam is it would appear a "marmite" thing, some say they have positive results, others claim it's highly toxic and should be avoided, as with all things, the answers to any questions about condensation and its cures seem to be very varied,
my intention is to glean as much first hand knowledge, and hopefully make an informed decision on those results.
thanks for the input so far. it is helpful.

my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


annville    -- Nov-15-2021 @ 3:02 PM
  Hi  yes it is DIY you buy/hire  a two cylinders you do need to mask up but unlike paint spraying not toxic and more controllable you spray as much/thick as you like suggest you try on a scrap piece of wood as it expands as it drys so you need to spray less thick then the final thickness you want, as it expands as it drys thicker you can go over it twice if it needs to be thicker.Google to get info. John



This message was edited by annville on Nov-15-21 @ 4:04 PM


Greybeard    -- Nov-15-2021 @ 3:35 PM
  https://www.attainablehome.com/dangers-of-spray-foam-insulation-and-how-to-protect-yourself/

suddenly the odd drip doesn't seem that bad. Confused

my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


annville    -- Nov-16-2021 @ 10:41 AM
  Hi Greybeard They are talking about professional house applications in attic's the DIY type is different plus you are only spraying a thin 1" 2" thick layer not a attic with 7" 8" thick i certainly have had no issues i did the whole of my interia engine room to locker interia's down to below water line i now can sit inside in shirt sleeves throughout the winter WITHOUT the central heating running constantly. John


Greybeard    -- Nov-16-2021 @ 11:04 AM
  @John,
I'm always a bit dubious of chemicals and such like, I don't even trust food manufacturers and their "e" numbers that hide carcinogenics etc,, so much that is reputed to be"safe" has turned out not so safe, especially in later life, tobacco, asbestos,etc.
I maybe over cautious but care,caution and research has kept me alive much longer than I believe bravado,chance and ignorance would have.

have you got a link to the stuff you used?
cheers.

my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


annville    -- Nov-16-2021 @ 2:07 PM
  Hi Now not to hand but if you google diy BOAT foam there are lots of info depending where you are closed foam i seem to remember is best for boats but ten years since i did mine, one of the better things i spent my money on. John


TerryTibbs    -- Nov-16-2021 @ 3:38 PM
  No matter what insulation you put in/on the hull and superstructure you won't get rid of the condensation unless you double glaze the Windows. Wooden roof is fine, if it's in keeping with the boat but unless you paint it a light colour the interior become either dark and oppressive or full of character depending on your outlook.

if it is to be it is up to me.


Greybeard    -- Nov-16-2021 @ 4:22 PM
  point taken on double glazed windows, that would be quite easy, windows are being resealed at present by BWR, once refitted I could add an interior glaze easy enough.
re darkness of wood,, I can live with that as its only an occasional  sleeping area.
success with preventing condensation appears a bit "hit and miss", with some things working for some and not others.
hopefully I'll get lucky.


my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


MandA    -- Nov-16-2021 @ 10:51 PM
  We have double glazed windows and  kingspan insulation fitted to hull and superstructure seems to work very well except we still get  condensation on the aluminium frame unfortunately, secondary double glazing should work well.
Adrian.

MandA


Greybeard    -- Nov-16-2021 @ 11:16 PM
  In discussion with a neighbour at the marina, and they said its possible to get some kind of paint, or coating which stop the aluminium from attraction the moisture.
he had no first hand evidence though, he heard it from a canal boat owner.

It's funny really, you ask a dozen people about curing condensation and the answers don't always point to any one thing that cures it.
but I thank all for their input, and will be looking into all methods.

my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


JollyRodger    -- Nov-16-2021 @ 11:23 PM
  The world's best cure for condensation is masses of ventilation, and warm, woolly pyjamas.  

Jolly Roger


Greybeard    -- Nov-17-2021 @ 12:11 AM
  ok, ventilation I have already, now how do I stick the woolly pajamas to the roof? Confused

my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


TerryTibbs    -- Nov-17-2021 @ 9:11 AM
  In discussion with a neighbour at the marina, and they said its possible to get some kind of paint, or coating which stop the aluminium from attraction the moisture.
he had no first hand evidence though, he heard it from a canal boat owner.
It's not a case of the Aluminium attracting the condensation it is more that the aluminium isa very efficient conductor of heat/cold and the surface will always be as cold as the outside temperature. The only way to stop condensation on the Ali frames is to introduce a thermal break, secondary glazing should do this but if you use Al frames the make sure the inner and outer frame are not touching.
p.s. No more nails should work well on the pyjamas Wink


if it is to be it is up to me.


annville    -- Nov-17-2021 @ 12:09 PM
  Ventilation is the cheapest and the best BUT not very comfortable, condensation can cause long term problems when it is out of site behind behind paneling and often found out to late. (Prevention is better than cure). John


Greybeard    -- Nov-17-2021 @ 12:19 PM
  fortunately I have only slight water staining below a leaking window, it's an old fishing boat so there is not much in the way of interior to spoil, the windows are being sorted as I type and hopefully with suitable measures to eradicate  [as much as is possible] I can make the interior a little more comfortable.
there is good access to the bilges and all looks sound below.



my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


TerryTibbs    -- Nov-17-2021 @ 12:58 PM
  If you have access to shore power at the moorings it may be worth considering a de humidifier, also try to ensure the bilges are kept dry and fit a bilge heater.

Dave

if it is to be it is up to me.


Greybeard    -- Nov-17-2021 @ 3:39 PM
  TT, the bow is the bunk area and there are 3 storage compartments underneath, happy to say all are bone dry, that area has a long but narrow window either side, all through the warmer weather there were no leaks or condensation, however as is got colder, and the arrival of a few heavy rains and wind, a few small leaks on the windows became visible, along with a bit of condensation, I have removed one window, and its now ready to go back in complete with new plastic and seals.
I shall then repeat on t'other side.

I will then combat the condensation, the spray foam approach looks to have a high success rate and its a relatively small area so would work quite well in application, and as the wood is a free offering I may as well invest the saving in decent insulation.
re,, secondary glazing  I was thinking maybe square closed cell foam securely fixed to inside frame and a clear plastic same as the existing one fixed to that, It might be possible to include a removable plug within the foam for the insertion of silica gel or similar.  
I'm open to suggestions.  

the rest of the boat is wheel house [covered but open at rear] and the rest is open fishing area.
hull is watertight but heavy rain without the cover will allow a small amount of run off to the bilge, and then auto pump removes that.

I don't have shore power at present, but it may well be a future consideration.

my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


annville    -- Nov-18-2021 @ 11:23 AM
  Hi I double glazed mine by buying Acrylic panels cut to window shape and secured using Velcro To fix them with which allows removing for cleaning etc works well hardly noticeable and evan prevents condensation  on the ally frames. John


Greybeard    -- Nov-18-2021 @ 7:33 PM
  John, so they don't have to be a totally sealed unit to work, [like a house window is]
if so that's even easier and simple to clean too.
thanks, much appreciated.

my appearance is down to me, my attitude is down to you.


annville    -- Nov-19-2021 @ 11:39 AM
  No mine are vented with a drain hole at the bottom so not airtight, only irritation is that spiders like it there i put a couple of little conkers in the space which works well and keeps them away. John


The Norfolk Broads Forum : http://www.the-norfolk-broads.co.uk
Topic: http://www.the-norfolk-broads.co.uk/viewmessages.cfm?Forum=38&Topic=44567