Topic: Pub Mooring charges - New Inn Horning


Seve    -- Jan-17-2022 @ 7:10 PM
  Travelled 130 mls today to try New Inn can confirm well worth trip pub and food back to top notch .
Only concern i booked moorings for later in year and was told over the high season a mooring fee of £10 to £ 15 to be confirmed will be payable asked if thos was refundable on food and drink and told no .
Think they will really have to re think or lower to £5 which is fair enough to pay up keep of moorings

Bryan

This message was edited by Seve on Jan-17-22 @ 8:15 PM


Marshman    -- Jan-17-2022 @ 10:17 PM
  I think you will find people will pay £10 without batting an eyelid especially if its half decent!


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-17-2022 @ 11:09 PM
  Oh dear ,  if that's the case we will not be visiting. I wouldn't pay to park my car in a pub or restuarant car park and I have no intention of doing that with the boat.

Rip off Britain sadly is a phrase becoming more and more true.

Very disappointing policy. We eat more and more on board than we ever did before. Not out of choice but as a result of little choice when it comes to spending on dining out. 17th season of boat owning on The Broads this year, but sadly at times, becoming more disheartening as the years progress.  Lunch out was a favourite, as was breakfast, in say, Horning.  All we do now is try to escape to quiet spots, float around on the mudweight ( but not so much on Salhouse these days as it's like a noisy holiday camp leisure activity pool ) and watch real wildlife. Mooring up and going for a walk is often a risky business too these days.

The one visit holidaymakers will probably pay up. The private owners who actually offer regular custom especially over the longer season, may well stick two fingers up at this type of policy.

Karen  




"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


martinward    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 9:21 AM
  I actually agree with Marshman, £10 to actually moor in Horning Village doesn't actually seem a bad deal to me as long as the pub continues to provide a good service and decent food and drink.


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 9:46 AM
  But would you pay a tenner to park your car every time you visit a pub ? That's the point I'm making.

I'm not saying a tenner to "moor at Horning" is expensive, I'm saying a tenner for the privilege of mooring up at the pub to be able to spend money in their restaurant is a bit of a rip off. If you can't see the difference...

Karen

"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


JollyRodger    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 10:02 AM
  I also agree with Marshman on this one!

Whilst I also wouldn't pay to park my car I do sympathise with the pub charging for a mooring. Firstly, the cost of maintaining a car park is somewhat less than it is for the moorings. Secondly, car parks aren't usually used for twelve hours or more by the punters.

If a pub charges a tenner and then offers a partial or complete refund then good for them.

Re private owners, mixed feeling on this one. Having owned a riverside pub I was glad of their business during the winter but not always during the summer. The pub business is about volume and turnover, not providing moorings for the weekend, as does happen all too often with private boats. Moor up, have a feed and a drink then go, allowing someone else to do the same. It doesn't always happen like that.  

Jolly Roger


martinward    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 10:03 AM
  I do agree that if you are a regular boat user that a £10 mooring fee does seem a bit steep but as a holiday maker looking for a pub mooring in an attractive riverside village then it is probably worth the money.
Having paid a £50 fine at the Swan Inn car park a couple of years ago for forgetting to give the pub my registration details then £10 probably does not seem a lot to me !!!


RedCow    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 10:44 AM
  The choice is yours,either pay the fee or don’t use the pub,I don’t consider the charge excessive for what they offer! You can moor elsewhere and walk to the pub if you object to paying.If you were referring to some hospital parking charges then I could support the thread.


warrior    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 10:45 AM
  Totally agree with Karen & Mike,  and it  brings to mind my remarks about Pirates , bandits etc on a previous post.  Total rip of IMHO.  It would seem that everyone these days is out to rip of the punters.  I certainly will not be using the New Inn until they do a refundable mooring fee as it used to be.  I  do not like profiteering!!!

Jason


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 10:47 AM
  JR, according to the OP there will be no offset against money spent in the pub. That's why I disagree with the policy.

A pub in a popular place is situated on the river.  More people visit the location by boat then by car,  so the pub has only a small car park and uses the large part of its exterior to provide a river front garden area and Moorings so as to attract the passing boaters to come and visit and spend money in its establishment.  So to me it seems wrong to then charge every visiting group of people £10 or £15  just to turn up on the basis that the Moorings are expensive to maintain.  When you consider how many people will visit that pub on a daily basis and even taking into account the cost of maintaining Moorings I think you have to agree that they'll be making a nice profit as well, on top of everything else.

Rip-off Britain and additional charges have got a lot to answer for.  Out of town shopping parks have torn up countryside areas whilst town centres flounder , because free parking is more attractive than local authority expensive car park charges. Huge new distribution warehouses are also ravaging our more rural areas in large swathes across the country, because building there is cheaper and the edge of town or out of town is easier for the huge amount of transportation that is now needed due to consumer demand for anything and everything, instantly. Anyway, I digress. Sorry! What with plastic grass in village conservation area gardens because the modern family is "too busy" to cut real grass, trees and shrubs destroyed to make way for little Jonny's huge trampoline etc etc , I'm feeling a little disillusioned with our world right now. Thank goodness my garden is still full of birds, and their song cheers me up.

Karen

"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 10:51 AM
  Yes Red Cow the choice is mine. Or anybody else's. But this is a discussion forum and we like to chew over changes. So it doesn't matter if you "support the thread" as you put it, or not - it's a topic the OP brought here for discussion.

Fully respect your personal view that the charge is acceptable to you.

Karen

"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 10:54 AM
  I'm with Karen and Mike on this, apart from the fact that in this day and age they are going to take a lot of money off anyone who moors and eats and drinks there, a £15 charge for stern on mooring at a busy noisy mooring that has no electricity (or does it now) no facilities other than toilet is a lot any way. I have no problem paying for moorings and always moor at the Yacht Stations in Oulton Beccles and Norwich, I think a pub charging and not refunding against a substantial is a disgrace but as Marshy says, plenty of people will so good luck to them. Personally that attitude will stop me visiting even by car and I'm sure others will feel the same.
I really did think we would come out of Covid better people but I'm afraid Karen's comment of Rip Off Britain is true in so many areas of life.

Dave

if it is to be it is up to me.


JollyRodger    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 1:46 PM
  No refunds! Wow, I won't be going there then!

Perhaps a daytime parking/mooring limit of two or three hours would be prudent.

Re profiteering, are they really? In business surely the name of the game is that investments provide a profit?

With landlords demanding huge rents from tenants, it is hardly surprising that assets are milked.

Do I agree? No, it's greed, and it's not limited to pubs.

A few years ago I attended a tolls review as did the proprietor of a large yard. He openly bragged that he did not anti-foul the bottom of his boats. That saved him a small fortune in slipping and paint but also the weed growth meant that his customers subsequently used more diesel, diesel that he sold at a premium price.





Jolly Roger


Dilligaf    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 3:01 PM
  This reminds me why I rarely venture up on the northern rivers, the beer price seems to go up as soon as you pass GY too, once we are in a pub we generally don't leave till closing time and don't drink slowly either, a pub bill for us is normally £80+ for an evening (including a meal each) at the best of times so I'm not about to start paying to visit before even going in.
Looks like the new inn will be off the list if I bother to venture that way.

Dave.
Formerly 'LeoMagill'


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 3:01 PM
  You aren't wrong JR, greed is the name of the game.

if it is to be it is up to me.


L'sBelles    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 4:13 PM
  Isn't that just capitalism?
Growth, growth, growth, money, money and more money!
They teach it at business school.
Unfortunately, we live in a world of finite resources and unlimited acquisition for everyone is simply not sustainable but we are reaping what has been sown!


hedgehog    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 4:44 PM
  We moored at The New Inn twice over Christmas and probably spent over £300 in the periods we were there. I liked everything about the place but would maybe have to think about it now , depending on the agreed charge. What I do know is that for all those who are categorically now refusing to go there, well then that is just another mooring spot for those who are willing to pay. Im not in favour of being allowed to pre-book a mooring more than 24hrs in advance as it probably means that just a chance spot being available whilst passing is highly unlikely.


Philosophic    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 4:45 PM
  £10 is not an unreasonable charge for a well maintained mooring, and when attached to a pub I would imagine that most of that charge is accrued for the inevitable day when the big expense comes, to replace the quay heading.
Therefore to refund that charge is in effect giving a preferential discount to those who arrive by boat.
Maybe those that arrive on foot should request a £10 discount for not bringing a boat?

“Stay away from negative people.
They have a problem for every solution.”

? Albert Einstein


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 5:34 PM
  It's also what causes inflation, so has to be balanced quite carefully. Thin end of the wedge, what next? Do they charge you for renting the table your sat at or the glasses you drink from?

if it is to be it is up to me.


Philosophic    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 5:57 PM
  "Do they charge you for renting the table your sat at or the glasses you drink from?"

I would guess no; since all customers require these services irrespective of whether they have already enjoyed a £10 free mooring.

“Stay away from negative people.
They have a problem for every solution.”

? Albert Einstein


warrior    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 7:13 PM
  Lets face it, the New Inn is the same as all the other pubs with moorings,  Total rip off merchants and out for a quick buck and exhorbitant profit.  ¬!!

Jason


Marshman    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 7:51 PM
  Jason - you clearly have no idea how expensive it is to replace quay heading! Not much profiteering going on!!!




Paladine    -- Jan-18-2022 @ 7:58 PM
 
Yet there are waterside pubs that charge much less, and even some waterside pubs that don't charge at all (provided you use the pub).

Been hit by another boat? Report the incident to the Marine Accident Investigation Branch’s dedicated accident reporting line on 023 8023 2527 which is monitored 24 hours a day.  Help to make the Broads safer.


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 12:22 AM
  Precisely! So why do others need to ? We can only assume it's as TT suggests - greed.

The New Inn has never needed to do this before and was always popular with holidaymakers, private owners and locals. We have in the past been part of a group of 8 at Halloween & New Years Eve parties, spending plenty of money, and when moorings were not completely full. Some of us have discussed this new policy already and said we feel we now won't be going there at all, even if the mooring fee may not be applicable at those particular times. We all usually visit at other times too but can't support these charges and thus the establishment.

We have never been back in The Swan since its implementation of charges, and we often pass by on a summers evening and it's not full.

With the cost of living rising so much I suspect that many holidaymakers will be carefully watching their pennies this year, and may well choose to cook and drink on board when faced with an extra £15 for a mooring when they can mudweight, wild moor or get in early at a 24 hour public mooring. They may also be looking carefully at what they are getting for their buck in terms of holiday accommodation costs, and be glad to turn their back on the UK and head for sunnier cheaper places ! The staycation honeymoon may be over...

Karen



"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 7:59 AM
  Marshy, you are right, quay heading is expensive to replace but taken over the life of the quay heading it is peanuts. Lets be very very generous and say it would cost £20k to replace the current quay, it would have an expected life of 20 years, that is £1000 per year, lets say 18 weeks peak season, thats £55 per week, thats 5.5 boats at £10 as I said profiteering (greed).

Dave

if it is to be it is up to me.


hedgehog    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 8:10 AM
  The £15 charge is unconfirmed. I really don't believe that the moorings will be empty because some choose not to go if there if they have to pay. I could see the issue if it was maybe a solo cruiser or even two folk on a boat who only wanted a snack or small meal, then yes , the cost could then be prohibitive. A boat with potentially four or more holiday makers on board , wanting to eat and drink for a period , - then the cost would only be a fraction of their spend. My average round in there is £10 for two people. If I really was so bothered then I could have one round less and moor up overnight.  


martinward    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 8:28 AM
  At the end of the day it is a matter of personal choice and we are not 100% sure about the fee situation yet.
If a fee is imposed that is not refundable then those who do not want to pay can go elsewhere and those that are happy to pay can pay and stay!


JeremyFisher    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 9:05 AM
  Well, its is nice to know that Womack will be quieter next year.  People do not seem to mind paying for mooring there, albeit less than the New Inn, but without the the samwe facilities.  The quay heading is being replaced there next month, the last time it was done was less than 20 years ago.   My quay heading only lasted 12 years.

Simon

A bad day on the water is better than a good day in the office.


BELLA    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 9:07 AM
  Will they be employing somebody to control the moorings?
Maybe yes and the fee is to cover their wages?
They won’t have anybody to control the car park so they will be able to have free parking?
This could be the answer that you can park free with a car but have to pay to moor a boat?


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 9:33 AM
  Bella, reasonable point, but they have always had someone controlling the moorings, It's a cost thart's built into the general wages bill, as are the glass collectors waitresses, waiters, bar staff etc.

Dave

if it is to be it is up to me.


hedgehog    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 9:41 AM
  The person who used to control the moorings doesn't work there now. He moved to the Ferry. Maybe he has negotiated a new contract Smile . There were only three boats moored at the New Inn  over Christmas and the manager told me that it was like "parking wars".


Dzign    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 9:43 AM
  it would have an expected life of 20 years, that is £1000 per year, lets say 18 weeks peak season, thats £55 per week, thats 5.5 boats at £10 as I said profiteering (greed).
Maybe years ago but since the additives that were impregnated into the timber were banned arsnic and the like, the timber above the water only lasts around 5 years

L

This message was edited by Dzign on Jan-19-22 @ 10:44 AM


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 11:28 AM
  "Maybe years ago but since the additives that were impregnated into the timber were banned arsnic and the like, the timber above the water only lasts around 5 years"
Absolute bulshine!

https://quayheading.co.uk/Materials_used_for_quay_heading.html

if it is to be it is up to me.

This message was edited by TerryTibbs on Jan-19-22 @ 12:31 PM


BELLA    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 12:55 PM
  TT, I fully agree with you that an employee working on the mooring would be built in their wage cost but this employee is still an extra cost to the wage bill and has to be payed for.

hedgehog, “The person who used to control the moorings doesn’t work there now.” “Maybe he has negotiated a new contract.”

The New Inn is now owned by The Stonegate Group, they state
“We are the largest pub company in the UK and employ thousands of staff across our Pubs, Bars, Clubs and Pub Support Centre.”

As a major company I would imagine that they have a large Health and Safety department.Also I would expect that an official receipt would be given with a VAT number.
Tax and VAT would then have to deducted from the mooring fee.

Maybe one of our members within the trade could give us more info.

NOTE Post moderated by mod team as  direct edit  as unable to contact member to request self edit.



This message was edited by Karen&Mike on Jan-19-22 @ 10:04 PM


Marshman    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 1:17 PM
  There is tanalising as it used to be, and tanalising as it is now!!

A 10 year life is probably about right these days, certainly to maintain a decent quality.

For what its worth and knowing the cost of piling, I don't see a lot of profiteering, especially when people will still pay up and the quay will still be pretty full.
You want a facility, you pay for it - not drop 10 bob in an honesty bow if you think about it!!!


Paladine    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 1:32 PM
 
"...especially when people will still pay up and the quay will still be pretty full."

I suspect it will be full of hire boats, not private boats. So be it. People coming on holiday tend to open their wallets rather more easily than they do at home.

I would be prepared to pay a mooring fee at a pub, IF the food was head-and-shoulders above the 'normal' quality of offering and so worth the premium. I rarely find that to be the case in these waterside pubs.

Been hit by another boat? Report the incident to the Marine Accident Investigation Branch’s dedicated accident reporting line on 023 8023 2527 which is monitored 24 hours a day.  Help to make the Broads safer.


hedgehog    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 3:09 PM
  Bella, my comment about him negotiating a new contract was purely tongue in cheek (see smile that followed it ). I would think if the person could sit or stand on the quay heading all day , drinking beer, then they would need to charge considerably more than £15 per boat ????. Paladine, in my humble opinion , their food , presentation and attitude are head and shoulders above what I’ve experienced locally. I, as a private boater would still moor there. If others choose not to , then that’s entirely up to them and I will gladly have their spot.


Paladine    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 3:57 PM
 
"Paladine, in my humble opinion , their food , presentation and attitude are head and shoulders above what I’ve experienced locally"

hedgehog, our experiences, or perhaps our expectations, clearly differ. As a local, I can visit all three pubs in Horning within a ten minute car journey, I choose not to, and I certainly don't visit them by boat.

Been hit by another boat? Report the incident to the Marine Accident Investigation Branch’s dedicated accident reporting line on 023 8023 2527 which is monitored 24 hours a day.  Help to make the Broads safer.


Philosophic    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 4:23 PM
  "As a local, I can visit all three pubs in Horning within a ten minute car journey, I choose not to, and I certainly don't visit them by boat".

So in the event you did visit and the moorings were free, how would you feel about knowing that a part of your bill was going towards the maintenance of moorings that you do not use?

“Stay away from negative people.
They have a problem for every solution.”

? Albert Einstein


hedgehog    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 4:30 PM
  Paladine, can I ask if you have visited the New Inn since its recent change of management


Dzign    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 5:21 PM
  TT I suggest you call Chris and ask him how long they are guaranteed or at least expected to last..

L


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 9:21 PM
  Ah, thanks to the info given about the new owning company - a huge pub co property business, I did a little teeny bit of research. Apparently the Stonegate group posted a £765m loss for 2020, so maybe the mooring fees are to go a little way towards "shoring up" that rather large hole?

Karen



"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


Marshman    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 10:18 PM
  They have a number of establishments in Norwich of which the Lamb Inn is one - its ok by my reckoning but although I do use it, not spectacular!

Other local establishments shown on their website!







hedgehog    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 10:52 PM
  Well done Karen, focusing on the negatives again.


Paladine    -- Jan-19-2022 @ 11:08 PM
 
"So in the event you did visit and the moorings were free, how would you feel about knowing that a part of your bill was going towards the maintenance of moorings that you do not use?"

Moorings are just another facility. If I go to any pub, I never watch their television, use their dart board, or any other distraction they may have on offer. But part of my bill goes towards providing and maintaining them. I can walk to my local pub, but don't give the maintenance of their car park, which I have never used, a single thought.

I have been to a very nice pub which provides free mooring. I've always travelled there by car, though. The prices of the meals are comparable to similar establishments, so I don't have the feeling that I am paying any more for my meal. Certainly not another £15.

Been hit by another boat? Report the incident to the Marine Accident Investigation Branch’s dedicated accident reporting line on 023 8023 2527 which is monitored 24 hours a day.  Help to make the Broads safer.


Chicol    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 3:54 AM
  Hi all. Lying on the beach here in Thailand this thread is a great read.  Back to the overall point. I’ve been a private boater for 6 years now and have only managed to more in horning once, there’s not enough public mooring, why I don’t know. Anyway, for me if I can pre book a mooring in horning occasionally, whether I eat there or not, it worth paying. By the way a long tail boat, on the broads would be a site. Back to the sunset Chang

Chicol


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 8:43 AM
  "So in the event you did visit and the moorings were free, how would you feel about knowing that a part of your bill was going towards the maintenance of moorings that you do not use?"
Couldn't the same be said about the car park?

dave

if it is to be it is up to me.


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 8:52 AM
  "TT I suggest you call Chris and ask him how long they are guaranteed or at least expected to last.."

Most QWuay Heading contractors quote 10 years as Marshy suggests, but look around the broads and you will see Quay headings including B.A. 24 hour moorings that have lasted much longer than that. As I said the £20k was over the top and would probably cover the cost of Plastic or steel but even at 10 years life the cost would only be £110 per month, 11 boats @ £10 or 7.33 boats @ £15, as I say, shear greed as the costs are already built into the cost of the drink and food they sell or am I wrong and they have reduced prices to take account of the new income stream/


if it is to be it is up to me.


Dzign    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 10:23 AM
  TT yes there are q headings that have possibly been there for a good time but the were installed before the preservatives that work were banned.
By the way I have got this info of an old boy (local) who has spent years building quay headings... he doesn't bother unless it's a regular as he can't even guarantee 10 years he still does regular building work.
20yrs these day's your dreaming...

L


annville    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 10:33 AM
  Moorings are a way of attracting passing trade for extra profit Bouchant Arms it a good example when they maintained the river bank they had lots of passing trade me included when they stopped cutting the grass so you could see where to put your footing nobody bothered to stop, the Ferry at Surlingham renovated there moorings now they are often full. A pub near us built a children's play area with a fence all round the garden result weekends where rammed with family mum's and Dad's could have a relaxing drink knowing that children couldn't leave the garden without passing through a gate that was in front of all the seats result more profit. John


Jean&Brian    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 10:51 AM
  While we rarely use pubs now we were regular customers of  the New Inn summer and winter as we were with one or two others including The Ferry till they started charging for mooring.

Depending on their pricing for food and drink and the quality of food and service I will decide whether any venue offers value for money or not, what I don`t expect is to be charged for giving them my custom and will not visit any establishment that charges me for the privilege, they might make hay during the holiday season but will loose out in the quiet months with many private owners.

As for upkeep and maintenance that is part of the overheads for any business and is amortised as such, the moorings would be listed as an asset within the businesses portfolio not a burden and should be regarded as such.

           Brian





TerryTibbs    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 11:37 AM
  "As for upkeep and maintenance that is part of the overheads for any business and is amortised as such, the moorings would be listed as an asset within the businesses portfolio not a burden and should be regarded as such."

At last, someone who understands how a business operates.

Dave


if it is to be it is up to me.


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 12:02 PM
  "T yes there are q headings that have possibly been there for a good time but the were installed before the preservatives that work were banned.
By the way I have got this info of an old boy (local) who has spent years building quay headings"
I got my info off reputable companies currently building Quay headings.

"TT yes there are q headings that have possibly been there for a good time but the were installed before the preservatives that work were banned"

The tanalising chemicals you speak of have been banned since around 2003 so any quay heading built since then comply to current standards.


if it is to be it is up to me.


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 12:15 PM
  Oh dear Hedgehog...

quote:"......
Well done Karen, focusing on the negatives again.
......."



... why did you pick out only my comment and label it as negative? I do wonder, as there are plenty of other comments here.

Anyway,  whilst also noting your comments in another post where you instruct members to stop gossiping, I'll just point out a little something which you may have overlooked ,  and that is the forum is a place for discussion and debate.  That by definition means points will be raised from all sorts of angles - some factual, some anecdotal, some opinions,  and yes some positive and some negative.  How do you think the world goes round ?!  This is not a place for only mutual  backstroking.

Such a shame that you couldn't see the humour in my post either and decided instead to have a little dig at me, and me alone.

Karen

"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 12:29 PM
  TT & Brian - yes absolutely all part of the business running costs. And as I and Anneville also mentioned, the moorings are there precisely to attract customers.

There have been some rather irrational ( in my opinion) points made here about justification for the mooring charges and how that fits with other aspects of the business and what it offers, and as Mr P points out many of us don't use the full array of what's offered by an establishment - be it the snooker table, the sports tv, etc. But all the costs of running the business are built in to their costs and charges.

I shop in Marks & Spencer's but don't use their cafe -  do I get a discount for my shopping? no !  Do I complain that they should've spent less on the Cafe fittings and more on the displays that I enjoy browsing but can't always reach ? No.  Do I expect the Cafe  customers to be charged an entry fee or do they expect me to pay extra to browse the shop ? No. Of course not.

Karen

"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"

This message was edited by Karen&Mike on Jan-20-22 @ 1:30 PM


Philosophic    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 1:33 PM
  I was brought up with the concept that nothing is for free, it may not be you at the time but eventually it has to be paid for by someone. I really have no objection to paying for a mooring as there is usually more to it than just some means to stop the boat from moving such as shopping, sightseeing, eating etc. the list is endless and there is some value derived from that mooring. If all that is needed is to stop the boat from moving whilst you eat, sleep relax etc. then there is the option of the free “mudweight” or the wild moor.

£10-£15 seems to be the going rate for a mooring without a pub or restaurant attached. As I understand that the cost to provide a mooring facility is a significant expense as opposed to a TV set or dartboard it seems reasonable to charge those that use this facility for its use, in the same way that tap water is usually free but beer is usually charged for,

Yes there are pubs that provide free moorings but having taken advantage of that facility I feel there is a moral obligation to eat and drink exclusively from that pub rather than use the food and drink on the boat, conversely having paid for a mooring I do not expect any concession on food or drink in the pub as I’ve already got what I paid for…the mooring.  


“Stay away from negative people.
They have a problem for every solution.”

? Albert Einstein


This message was edited by Philosophic on Jan-20-22 @ 2:34 PM


TerryTibbs    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 2:34 PM
  " cost to provide a mooring facility is a significant expense as opposed to a TV set "
The cost of providing a mooring is significantly less than they pay for SKY, I don't watch sport so why should I have to subsidise those that do? Because it's part of the overhead, just as the cost of providing a mooring is.

if it is to be it is up to me.


Jean&Brian    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 2:38 PM
  I think there is a difference between when the mooring is the facility and when you are paying to spend more money in the proprietors establishment.

        Brian


Philosophic    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 3:11 PM
  "I think there is a difference between when the mooring is the facility and when you are paying to spend more money in the proprietors establishment".

A good point but surely would only be valid if you moved the boat after eating/drinking as you would remove a car from the establishment car park.

“Stay away from negative people.
They have a problem for every solution.”

? Albert Einstein


This message was edited by Philosophic on Jan-20-22 @ 4:12 PM


warrior    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 3:49 PM
  Going back to Marshman's reply to my earlier post regarding the cost of key headings.  Why should they be a special case for charging people to moor?  Car parks have to be maintained, Buildings have to be maintained and the services inside and out have to be maintained and there is not a special charge for them so why should a quay heading be any different.  and there are still pubs that do not charge and they seem to do alright.  Incidently  I do know how much a metre quay headings cost.  

Jason


Dzign    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 4:01 PM
  The significant preservatives in *rs*nic and chromium were banned in 2006 but I guess supplies were still available for some time after

L


MandA    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 4:07 PM
  Perhaps the New Inn would be better off having no moorings to allow there customers a pleasant view of the river instead of slab,s of grp,
Adrian.

MandA


BELLA    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 4:07 PM
  As normally happens with a lot of our debates there is always lots of assumptions.

In Seves opening he stated “a mooring fee of £10 to £15 to be confirmed.....” and “will really have to re think or lower to £5 which is fair enough to pay upkeep of moorings”

1. As stated this has not been confirmed.
2. Who has said that the fee was to pay for the upkeep of the moorings?
(Much discussion about the costs of maintaining the moorings)

The New Inn is a business.
“Business is the activity of making ones living or making money by producing or buying and selling products.”

When the New Inn was taken over they knew that they would have two product lines to sell.
1. Drinks.
2. Food.

It would not take long for a Director or Account to see that because of demand in the high season they have another product to sell “The Moorings” and all they are looking at is profit. THAT’S BUSINESS!

Drink sales               £..........
Food sales.              £..........
Mooring fees            £..........
Total.                        £...........
Costs.                     -£...........

PROFIT.                   £xxxxxxxxxxYum yum THAT’S BUSINESS


If you took your Camper Van, tent or caravan to a campsite attached to a pub and stayed overnight would you expect to stay for free?

What’s the difference to tying your boat to a private mooring overnight?




hedgehog    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 7:00 PM
  nobody has ever mentioned that the mooring charge was to contribute towards the cost of the upkeep of the quay heading. It was just mentioned that there could be a mooring charge applied in the future.


BELLA    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 7:33 PM
  hedgehog, I think that you should go back to the first post by seve and read it all of the way through.

For your help the last line reads, “Think they will really have to re think or lower to £5 which is fair enough to pay up keep of moorings.”

“pay upkeep of moorings.”


hedgehog    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 8:01 PM
  Thanks for your help with that Bella. Apologies , I had not read that as thoroughly as I should have . I hope that “help” from you was genuine and not in anyway meant in any other way . There are certain folk on here who really think they have a right to speak to people on this forum in a rather derogatory manner.  




aboattime    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 8:31 PM
  When the pub was run by Ann and Gus was running the moorings/garden, the pub was always busy and they didnt need to charge for moorings, presumably because they were making healthy profits on the excellent food, drink and service.It was always our go to pub,either by boat or car,so cant help feeling the mooring charge is a bit of a rip off,remember that the only thing they insisted on was if you moor then you book a table to eat there, that always seemed fair to me.

kindest regards

Kevin Cook


BELLA    -- Jan-20-2022 @ 8:38 PM
  hedgehog, thanks for your apology, I often get my postings attacked so may have responded to you in defence mode.
Apologies to you if I replied inappropriately


Jean&Brian    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 7:50 AM
  "A good point but surely would only be valid if you moved the boat after eating/drinking as you would remove a car from the establishment car park."

If we only stop for lunch then we do, but when we along with friends are there till closing time up to 1.00am on occasion and then go in for breakfast the following morning (up to 10 covers) no.

           Brian



This message was edited by Jean&Brian on Jan-21-22 @ 8:51 AM


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 9:03 AM
  Totally agree with you there Brian.

Philosophic’s point about leaving the mooring after eating,  like you would leave a car park, fails to take account of the fact that hire boats or not permitted to navigate after dark, so that option isn’t there.

I would also like to add a response to an earlier comment  from another member - I don’t believe anyone raising objections here or expressing their opinions about the rights and wrong of the matter were somehow brought up inadequately and don’t appreciate that they should pay for things! Bit below the belt that one.

Someone also mentioned they don’t like the attitude of some people on this forum , and the way they address other members. So just a couple of points:

- Firstly,  as mods we do keep an eye on the content in relation to the terms of service but if anyone has a particular complaint can I suggest they send a personal message to a member of the admin team in case we have missed something.

- Secondly , please be aware this is a discussion forum and we do allow people to express their opinions and challenge other people’s.

Cheers all. May we continue our open & interesting discussions which sometimes bring about change - even in just the opinions of others.

Karen


"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


Helmsman1946    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 9:24 AM
  I will not name it but one Pub realising there will be huge expenditure needed in the not to far distant future for reconstruction of their quay so started to charge a non-refundable £10 overnight charge in 2021, however they now take advance bookings and it seems to have worked out well for all


hedgehog    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 9:25 AM
  Karen, re Philosophic's point about leaving the mooring after eating.A lot of boats moor up during the day to have lunch so it would not be dark when it was time to leave so that option would be there. Not all of the customers are hire boats , so that option would be there also. I would like to think that at the time it was dark most folk on the river would be moored up and hopefully would not be needing those at the New Inn.


BELLA    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 9:34 AM
  Karen, sorry I feel your last post is a little bit confusing, as a recent poster could you please identify who your comments where aimed at.
Thanks


Dilligaf    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 9:41 AM
  Of course if you are paying to moor there's nothing stopping you from walking past the pub and eating and drinking elsewhere, something that I despise on a normal free pub mooring and a reason I don't object to a redeemable fee either, but a straight non redeemable fee leaves you under no obligation to use the pub as you've paid for the mooring.

Dave.
Formerly 'LeoMagill'


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 10:04 AM
  Bella as a mod I read all the posts I can, in between doing my job, or my daily life. We all do. We also communicate with each other, approve new members, posts etc.

If I've seen something or things ( plural) that need a general response about how the forum runs then I might quickly address that without going back through a current thread to ascertain precisely who said what. When I'm browsing on an evening I may habevthe time. My choice really.  I'm about to attend an online meeting so  i'll be signing out shortly.  

I guess if you were the person who said the things I was referring to you'll know that ! And so I'm not sure why you'd be confused.  I recall I was picking up on one or two different points , actually.  Im not exactly sure why it matters but as my mum used to say if the cap fits, wear it?

I'm aware there have been another couple of other posts which I'd like to respond to as a member with my contribution,  but I've had to use my time up with this message.  I'll be back later.

Karen

"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


BELLA    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 10:44 AM
  Karen, I am sorry that you have responded in this way, I asked you in a polite way wanting to know if I was in trouble.
There was no animosity towards you, the mods or anybody else, with this topic being busy the cap could fit a number of people.
As you stated you made notes a while ago so we are back to square one, who were they aimed at.
I understand that you are a busy person, have a good meeting.
Thanks

Edited for spelling mistake, slap wrist.


This message was edited by BELLA on Jan-21-22 @ 11:48 AM


Philosophic    -- Jan-21-2022 @ 11:48 AM
  I've been questioned on my comment about leaving a mooring after eating/drinking. You may recall that comment was in response to a point that if a car park is free then so should a mooring be.
The logic behind my comment was that unless the car park is used in exactly the same way as the mooring (for whatever reason) then it is not a true "apples for apples" comparison.

“Stay away from negative people.
They have a problem for every solution.”

? Albert Einstein


This message was edited by Philosophic on Jan-21-22 @ 7:12 PM


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-25-2022 @ 2:34 PM
  Hi Bella, busy few days so just picking up on things.

As you know we do have a private message system but if you choose not to use it it does make things a little more difficult,  and public.

I do need to clarify one thing, in relation to my comment re my mums old saying "if the cap fits wear it"  in that there should've been a playful emoticon at the end of that comment.  What you got however was a question mark because that's what happens when using an iPhone and clicking on the smiley faces available there instead of clicking on the forum specific options. Oops.  Sorry. I should've known because I've done this before.


Karen



"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"

This message was edited by Karen&Mike on Jan-25-22 @ 3:53 PM


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-25-2022 @ 2:52 PM
  To pick up on some other comments in response to points I made.  Yes I do understand the difference between night and day and my comments about boats leaving after dark were specific to evening customers and hire boats. I was not suggesting it applied to all customers at any time,  and private boats.

Have to also totally agree with another comment made that if it's a straightforward charge for the Moorings then it's inevitable that people will pay for the mooring and then do what they want with their evening i.e. not give any custom to the New Inn.  Which does bring another of my mum's favourite sayings to mind :  they'd be "cutting off their nose to spite their face"  Playful Wink  

Each pub Moorings situation is different and there is the problem that Horning village is a popular spot to visit but offers few Moorings,  so I do think it's likely that some would pay the charge to moor up,  not use the pub at all and expect to be in position for 24 hours,  whereas in the past people would stop for lunch and move off mid afternoon giving the opportunity for those who had booked a table to turn up at 4,5 or 6 pm, be sure of the mooring availability having booked a table,  spend their money in the pub and then depart after breakfast the following day.

Karen  

Karen

"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


amberman    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 12:45 PM
  I don't normally book moorings this early, but as she was off yesterday, I got my wife to book a couple of moorings for early July where I know we need to be.
Horning Sunday night and Reedham Friday night

So, when I came home she told me she'd booked the moorings however The New Inn charged her £15 for the the mooring (card payment taken) and booked us a table with the dog

Whilst I'd rather it be free, £15 to guarantee getting moored in Horning, when there are very few options is ok to me

I don't know if they are charging for mooring out of season

I know there are many that will be appalled and wont use the place but with only 8 moorings I reckon they'll be full during the summer, for me not to pay £15 and risk not getting moored would be 'cutting my nose off to spite my face' to quote someone's mother!  
Wink


Karen&Mike    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 2:15 PM
  Thank you - we now have confirmation that the mooring charge, at least in the summer months, and possibly other busy times,  will be £15 at the New Inn.

Fully respect everyone's opinion and of course those who wish to pay up are free to do so. I think what we are talking about here is the bigger picture,  and what people see as the rights and wrongs of such charges.  For me personally I might consider a £15 mooring charge so as to spend the afternoon and overnight on a mooring in Horning once in a while  but I wouldn't be patronising the New Inn for our meal.  Unless of course Amberman you can confirm that the charge and the booking for a mooring was only taken on the basis that you were also booking a table for dining ?

As I said before if you are on holiday then these one-off charges can be seen as part of your holiday "spends"  but if you are a local boatowner and this is, or rather was, your pub of choice when on the water for meals then that £15 every visit becomes quite expensive! I suppose in the end it's what has happened in many holiday destinations whereby the tourists will pay anything and then the locals are effectively pushed out.  Many places in Cornwall for example are nothing more than a ghost town out of season,  with both homes and businesses really being there to serve the tourist industry only .  Let's hope the New Inn can manage to run profitably without local boaters support.  I suppose they will because they'll be ripping off the tourist ...

Karen


"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


martinward    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 3:57 PM
  We visited the New Inn by car between Christmas and New Year and have to say the cost of the food was competitive. If I had paid £15 to moor for the night there and had value for money in the pub then I would not begrudge paying the fee in addition to the food cost.
Everyone will have there own opinion on this and there is no simple answer here but at the end of the day as long as the pub continues to trade profitably then surely it is better to have this than no pub at all.





Dzign    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 3:58 PM
  Never been a fan of the new inn personally and didn't use it when it was free, can't see anything changing then...

L

This message was edited by Dzign on Jan-28-22 @ 4:59 PM


Jean&Brian    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 5:19 PM
  As a 12 months of the year boater just like the Ferry Inn if my custom in the summer is not valued they wont get it in the winter months when customers are few and far between.

       Brian




REDKEN    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 5:37 PM
  I think that holiday makers in the UK are in for a bit of a shock this year.

A pint of bitter and a glass of wine on the Broads recently cost £12.25, and prices seem to be going up by the week.

I have not compared boat hire charges, but it is looking very expensive once you get here.


Dzign    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 8:41 PM
  That seem a bit on the steep side...
Never mind I'm just off to spoons with all the other morons who like to pay under a 5er for a Guinness and a pint of bitter
Happy days...

L


flonker    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 9:02 PM
  Respect Dezign.
Do what you want. Do what you feel happy with, content, able to enjoy. Happy for others to do what they wish to do. It is none of my business, and may I suggest that you feel the same. I hope, I think we are of a same.

Dwile Flonker


JollyRodger    -- Jan-28-2022 @ 10:59 PM
  My wife and I turn up at the New Inn, it will cost me £15.00 to moor for a pint and perhaps a meal.
On the other hand, a ten berth holiday boat moors up, they too will be expected to pay £15.00, probably out of a shared kitty. I can only guess but I expect that the New Inn has decided on its target market, and it looks as if it excludes the likes of me and mine. Oh well, back to The Locks!




    

Jolly Roger


bigcal    -- May-4-2022 @ 10:56 AM
  I know its been a few months since the last post in this topic so I was wondering if anyone can confirm the mooring charges at the New Inn? We are down in July and just trying to decide where our overnights will be.

Iain


Karen&Mike    -- May-4-2022 @ 12:58 PM
  I'm afraid I can't speak personally as the pub is no longer a spot to visit for us based on the policy. The last 3 weeeknds we've been down we've used other places I'm afraid.

However, a chap who moors in our cut did say they had been charged , as outlined in this thread. I suppose your best bet is to ring the pub with a date and mooring booking request, and you will get a definitive answer for that specific time.

Karen

"Wind up the elastic band Karen - we're setting off!!"


martinward    -- May-4-2022 @ 1:42 PM
  I recently e.mailed the pub and got a reply saying that the overnight mooring fee is £15 which includes an electrical hook-up if available. Unfortunately this is not refundable against purchases there.


amberman    -- May-4-2022 @ 2:38 PM
  As I said earlier in this thread, we've booked a mooring in early July and have already been charged for it
I'm not bothered as I have a guaranteed spot in Horning, but I can see why it upsets some

On this subject, I heard that The Ferry at Stokesby have started charging for mooring, anyone confirm this and if so is it refundable against food/drink?


Dzign    -- May-4-2022 @ 4:40 PM
  The farm moorings were 8.00 overnight last weekend I believe.
Acle Bridge were 8.00 non refundable Easter

L


ncsl    -- May-4-2022 @ 7:38 PM
  I wonder how many car owners would be prepared to pay £15  to park a car there and have a meal or drink. ????


I cruise on THE NORFOLK BROAD as I can not cruise on something that is NOT.

Official Photographer.
Video


Philosophic    -- May-5-2022 @ 2:40 PM
  For those that have already paid almost £500 per night for a luxury cruiser, I doubt that an additional £15 would be an issue.

Most people spend more time and energy going around problems than in trying to solve them.

Henry Ford


The Norfolk Broads Forum : http://www.the-norfolk-broads.co.uk
Topic: http://www.the-norfolk-broads.co.uk/viewmessages.cfm?Forum=19&Topic=44655